While I don't know how many Class Site Admins are Apple "Mac" users, I have been contacting them to see who would be interested in becoming involved in such a group, should the good folks at Class Creators be willing to add a new section to these Forums just for Mac users.

Those of us that are "died in the wool" Mac users, know the problems that we have encountered with Class Creators software written for and by PC users. One of the biggest problems that I've seen/experienced is that each one of us will have a certain issue when we use our normal "Safari" browser and after several attempts trying to make both Safari and Firefox to work the way we want, with lots of back and forth postings between either Brad or Kyle and the Mac User--the issue may or may not be resolved. If another Mac user spots this interaction going on in time, we often have already found the work around that fixes the issue. Yes, sometimes it is something simple. However, one thing that I myself have found is that Safari for Mac works differently than Safari for the PC. Just as IE for the PC works differently than IE for a Mac.

I'm asking for a new section to be added to the Forum section called "For Mac Users" (or something similar). I'd also like to hear from any/all other Mac users that I haven't contacted personally. Send me an e-mail at admin@bothellhigh61.com if you would like to be part of such a group. Thanks everyone!

I use a Mac! Would love to use safari and stay away from Firefox. Ok at first but, not sure what to trust anymore!

Perfectly valid suggestion but I'm opposed to a Mac forum here. Let me tell you why:

Primarily I'm not in favor of it as it pertains to this statement above: "Class Creator's software written for and by PC users." While it is true that the vast majority of people hit class web sites here with PCs, certainly there are Mac users out there, and you're talking to one right here. I use both platforms based on the need. As developers we can't ever have the impression out there that the system is by and for PC users. The system absolutely has to work on Mac the same as it works with any PC browsers.

Now, that's not to say that there certainly haven't been a number of Mac and/or Safari only issues, because clearly there have been. But I doubt there are many if any outstanding at this time. So, my reasoning behind not having a dedicated Mac forum:

1) If we do our job correctly there shouldn't be a need for such a forum. As time has gone by we've become far more adept at handling and anticipating cross platform issues. There was a greater need for this in the past for sure, but I'm not seeing it now.

2) Mac users really aren't going to know if X or Y problem is a Mac specific problem or not. They might think it is though. And those issues are going to wind up in the Mac forum. When in reality (I bet 90%+ of the time) they were actually non Mac-related issues. Those posts winding up in the Mac forum now have no benefit to the PC users, when in fact they could have, because the problem was likely universal.

Mac problems shouldn't be worked around, they should be eliminated. It's our job to do that. If we have to have a whole forum here just for Mac users then we're definitely not doing something right. For fun I just saved a file on my desktop here I called "Mac Only Issues." Let's spend a few week tracking how many Mac-specific issues there really are here. I bet it won't be very many. If I'm wrong about that I'll rethink the Mac Users forum. Fair enough?

Agree with Brad. I think if we are Mac users we under stand the working of both systems. I was avid Microsoft user until my mac.

Have a MOUS Certificate.

Having said that ... Been away from MS long enough not sure I know how to get around microsoft video. (Not sure how to make it viewable for mac!

My issues with foxfire is all the additional things they have there to make life easier ... but, it takes over and makes some things sticky which replaces after you've just removed it because it slows things down!

Brad,

I agree in part with what you are saying. One thing however is that your Safari is not the same as our Safari. I have recently purchased a PC with Windows 7 Home Premium installed. It has no e-mail--is dedicated to testing websites (including my Class Creator site) with IE. And there in comes the "rub." One of my first problems when I joined this forum, turned out to be a Safari issue. After several attempts between you and I trying to find what was wrong, I finally discovered that the problem was directly with Safari. Viewing it in Firefox and IE on my PC everything worked fine. I posted an "Alert" on my web-page to let my users know they might have a problem if they used Safari. I also pointed this out on that forum page. Now the next person who has a Mac using Safari, comes along and has the exact same problem (or very close to it) goes thru the same scenario. You or Kyle or Jessica or xxx comes along and goes thru the whole scenario again (you don't remember where the discussion was or can't find it) or the other CC-guru's don't know about the problem. So my point for such a group is a way to keep track of those "unique" problems & work-arounds that one Mac user has had to share with all the other Mac users (some who haven't even heard of CC yet, but will be joining in the future--who have a place to go, rather than start the discussion all over again).

I just don't believe in re-inventing the wheel, when it would be just as easy to have a place where Mac users can go see if their problem is related to their browser or something they are or are not doing correctly. I apologize for the statement I made earlier "that CC is written for and by PC users." I now realize those was a harsh statement.

Hear ya. I'm convinced though that what you just described won't be happening in the future like it may have at one time. Like I said if I'm wrong I'll rethink it. I'm absolutely convinced that Mac users are going to post issues in a Mac forum that wind up having nothing whatsoever to do with Macs or Safari. I'll bet you anything if we create a dedicated Mac forum that's what will happen. And then people will wind up learning that their problem was not Mac related.

Curious, do you have any Mac only or Safari for Mac only issues at this time? I.E. is there anything in the system currently that works for PC users, that doesn't work for the Mac OS in general, or specifically for the Mac Safari browser? If there are any open issues I'm not aware of them, and I really don't think there will be many more. Note I didn't say any -- I just don't think there will be many.

Have Mac folks been using Google Chrome successfully?

I think that if we have mac in the topic title under this forum you will find me.

I've not had issues that you haven't been able to advise me about.

My biggest problem was not seeing everything while using safari. I called for help and she kept saying something about something written under a box. I didn't realize there was a box!

We've got a disclaimer on our home page that tells people to try different search engines. Sadly, some people don't know what we are talking about!

My biggest problem as I said ... isn't with CC but, firefox. I never know if one of their tools or Face books is going to cause a problem. Just ran into that recently.

I've downloaded chrome a couple of times. Don't know if I launched it correctly. It says it would down load faster. But, I'm not sure I have done it correctly.

Is it a search engine I need to open or is it an add on to the other google?

At this very moment Brad, I myself do not have any issues. However, Deborah doesregarding her school picture playing hide & seek. I have several different browsers that I keep active on my Mac (and soon will be adding to the PC) such as Opera, Camino, Flock as well as Firefox, IE, Safari as well as the cross-platforms for each that I can locate. (This might be overkill, but it has saved me a couple times in the past.)

My request for having a Mac Forum was not intended to be an isolation section, but more a place where us Mac users could check and see if the problem they were having--has been discussed and resolved before--BEFORE they go and try to reinvent the wheel all over again. However, I'm willing to let you build up your database with the same questions being asked by multiple users and also see what new things we can find, so you won't be out of a job anytime soon!

Norma,

I like your suggestion--if we have any issue that we as Mac users have that we be sure to put the word "Mac" in the title, we will always be able to find it when we do a Search.

I too tried using Chrome and as best as I could tell it did nothing positive for me. Until Windows 7 came along, PC users never knew what it was like to see their computers boot in 15 seconds or less (like my iMac does and my MacBook Pro takes only 10 seconds to boot up and be fully operational). Windows 7 isn't that good, but far better than any of the previous operating systems. I used PC's for 26 years (and still would if it weren't for my needing a new computer just when MS was trying to force Vista on me), that's when I kissed MS goodbye.

Mac user here too. I used either Firefox or Safari while I set up and continue to tweak our site. I really haven't had THAT big of issues. If/when I do, I simply contact our support system (Brad and the awesome CC team - THANK YOU BTW!) and BAM it's corrected or I figure it out. I am willing to help - and have already - anyone who needs help with Mac or PC.

I am not a MAC user and I have problems with Firefox when trying to do some things on CC. I just use IE for most of my CC uploads and updates to avoid the problems.

Don't get me wrong, not pushing IE just trying to point out that there can be browser issues regardless of the OS/hardware platform.

I'm a Mac/Safari user. Going forward, I'll put "Mac" in the subject line if I think something is a Mac only issue. So far, I haven't had any issues that I think are Mac only issues.

Elizabeth and other Mac users,

I think for the time being putting "Mac" in the title is a good idea. The real problem stems from the fact that every browser has different issues. What will happen is that one of us will quite innocently post a problem that we are having. It's likely that you won't know even after several posts that either this exact same issue has been discussed before (resolved or not), until someone recalls that it has been previously discussed and where that post is located. Maybe your issue is the very first time it is posted. Did you put "Mac" in the title--NO! So now where are we? Maybe putting the name of the BROWSER you are using in the title would be better solution. However, if you are using a browser on a cross-platform, then it would be best to list it like this: "Safari for PC" or "IE for Mac" so when doing a search a year or two from now, the person would know up front what the REAL issue is .

My 2 cents, for what it's worth.

Brad has the ability to move a topic from one forum to another. What if, whenever an issue has been clearly identified as being "Mac only", Brad moves it to a Mac Only Issues forum?
Brad would make it so that only he can add new topics (like with his New Features forum), this would keep universal issues from being added there.

Just a thought.

Let's see what Brad has to say about that!

Heh. You guys just want that Mac forum don't ya! Brad has to say he's not expecting there to be very man (if any) Mac issues. Thus if I'm right there won't be any items to move. The ONLY possible Mac issue I'm even aware of right now may or may not even be a Mac issue. It's a spooky issue where a school photo is not displaying. But only on 1 person's Mac, and no other Macs apparently. Aside from that everything should work on Mac just fine, both now and in the future. So....I don't want to create a Mac forum now, have nothing in it at all, and then end up moving few if any items to it. If people click on a forum there should be something there for them to see. If we're diligent in our own OS testing the Mac forum would be incredibly small.

There ya go folks, that's what I think, and by the way, I'm a Mac user! The videos on our own web site were produced and edited with Final Cut Pro on a Mac by Yours Truly. I think you guys might think I'm somehow "anti Mac" but that's far from the case. I just truly think there shouldn't be a valid need for a Mac forum here, because every single function on Class Creator should work perfectly fine on both PCs and Mac. That's the only reason I'm against it. I also think Steve Jobbs is one of the most brilliant guys in the industry, even though Al Gore invented the Internet.

Brad,

I think as this thread has evolved, my term "Forum" was probably the wrong direction from what I was thinking from the get-go. My last post probably focused more in the direction I was trying to go from the beginning of this thread. (BTW, I'm glad to know that you ARE a Mac user.) One of my first posts as you may recall had to do with someones name from the Class of 1959 showing up on any/all notices where a new classmate on our Class of 1961 site and was part of the "Reply-To" address. You got me hooked up with Mike and for a couple weeks or so we wrangled with that issue (which btw, seems to have resolved itself, my friend Colleen is no longer showing up--even though both of you just threw up your hands). There have been other similar issues that a few others have posted (as well as myself) and I found that some things that Safari can't do, Opera can. And then just when I think Opera is the savior, it isn't and I have to go to Firefox or IE. Many times IE-8 won't do things that IE-7 or IE-6 can do. (Even MS has admitted to some bugs in IE-8.) How many unsuspecting people have IE-8? Some of us beta testers can really give you a run for your money.

Are you talking about the issue where the email program was displaying the wrong FROM name? While I must admit I did throw up my hands on that one, the Programmer did solve it, resolution listed here. Some email programs automatically assign an address to a Contact name, especially if you've actually added the person to your Contact List yourself. When that happens, the FROM name that displays comes from your own email program rather than the system. The solution that seems to work is simply removing the person from your Contact List (which is a good thing to do anyway considering noreply@classcreator.net is not really their email address). Problem solved.

Yes, that was the one. Mike did get back with me several days later with the solution. I have been using "Apple Mail" for the past 3 years. My iMac-24 has been found to have some strange happenings that even the Apple techs have no understanding or knowledge of. So today, I just received my new "refurb" iMac-27 & this weekend will be setting it up. Hopefully a lot of these weird happenings will disappear, so I can go try and "break someone else's program" without my own bugs interfering.

I still feel there is a need to maybe have a cross-reference file based on certain browser issues. I wonder how many times a day you get the same question asked (maybe slightly different words) and I bet one of the most popular one is: I have a lot of white space between xxxx and zzzz on my home page. What's going on and how do I fix it? Of course what they don't know is that sometimes fixing it for one browser really messes things up for a different browser. I know that Firefox for instance renders things quite differently than IE (which often takes the approach--"I think I know what the person had in mind" and totally blows it!

As you and anyone who's been here for awhile knows, there's certainly been a variety of unique browser issues in the past. The need for such a cross reference file is growing less and less fortunately, although if you have some thoughts on how such a file would be presented I'm all ears (or eyes I guess). Are you thinking an FAQ entry or what exactly, and are there any issues you know of that would start off the file?

Today the browsers we support (listed on our home page) really don't have significant differences in the way pages are rendered. Especially if you have the latest and greatest version of your primary browser.

For instance, IE8 handles white space issues the exact same way Firefox does now. And the exact same way that Google Chrome and Safari handle it too. So when you fix a white space issue for any browser, it really does fix it for all of them now. I don't know of a single case where fixing a white space issue in one browser today would mess up the page for another browser. Standards are good.

I'll include one more thing here for the techies out there, but as we further develop the system, add new designs, etc. we'll be making use of the latest and greatest CSS, which means browser differences will be lessened more than ever. We're admittedly a little "old school" here, which means we've all been doing this for a very long time (15 years now with the same core team working together). The good thing about that is we've lasted 15 years as a team, which means we must be doing something right. The bad thing about that means there's some modernizing to do. So despite some kickin' and screamin' the gals and guys here are into the CSS books and everything else as we try to keep the system on the cutting edge. With a little luck we might just do that.

I got a kick out of reading along in this thread, Brad.
Mac-Windows-Safari-IE, but just to make things interesting, don't forget about us Linux users!

Everything on the CC site works fine on my Linux/Firefox PC, though - so far.

Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.1.11) Gecko/20100714 SUSE/3.5.11-0.1.1 Firefox/3.5.11

You guys have a lot of useful tips here.

I have to admit I thought the answer was solved when I used FireFox. But, whatever inhancements they have added made my mac go crazy.

I stopped using safari and primarily used Firefox so I could work on my school's website and have other things open as well.

After the reunion, I laid off the site for awhile. Now that most of the changes have been made I can see everything I couldn't see from safari before. (I think!) I didn't know until I called on something and she said "You can't see that? Are you using a Mac?"

Then I was able to build my site around the changes made.

This spring a lot of things started acting weird. I was getting FAKE PROFILES on FB and it felt like someone was on the computer with me.

At any rate I've replaced my second HD on here. The first in the middle of the reunion money gathering and now. I really think all the inhancements and add ons of FireFox adn the addition of chrome could have been part of it.

The few things I've done recently I've done on Safari.

Are the issues with Safari resolved so I don't have to use any other browser?

I'm more inclined to think that we do need a thread to discuss problems with mac on a thread than I was in the begining of all this talk of a Forum.

Thank you!
Norma

The issue there was caused by the latest version of Safari for Mac along with the latest version of Adobe Flash. Safari quickly updated releasing a new browser, fixing the problem. No plans for a Mac only forum at this time.

Norma,

You need to be sure that you have Safari vers. 5.0.2 If you don't--go get it! It has taken Apple a long time, but I've got to say that they have finally done things RIGHT. No new bugs--it's a dream to use. I just hope they don't come out with 5.1 for a L-O-O-O-N-G-G TIME!

Thanks you guys ... Glad to find out I was supecting the right problems!

So are we able to see everything with Safari now or do I still have to use FireFox? Don't want to go through that again.

Been leary of FireFox.

Have you ever gotten Chrome to work? Is it a program like FirFox or is it just an inhancement to firefox or Google?

Chrome IS Google's browser. I've used it on my Mac, but like everything else in the computer world it has problems. I myself am using Safari 5.0.2 almost exclusively on all websites. Not just CC. I have 8 different browsers (7 that I use mostly for testing purposes).

I think Firefox has more problems with their latest upgrade on a Mac--so I don't use it much. Now these are just my personal opinions--no flames needed!

I agree. Do you have any problems with this site now with Safari?